joshulux ([info]joshulux) wrote,
@ 2006-03-10 02:18:00
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Current mood: sentimental

clean-ey
Tonight, being the first night away from the three shows I have done in as many weeks, I returned to the task of cleaning my room. Going through old boxes of things left over from when I moved here is harder work that it would be if I weren't quite so sentimental. Sorting through piles of papers I find little notes written to me and ticket stubs from this or that, and I think of how it didn't seem so long ago and wish longingly for those times which have long since passed.

I'm a sucker for the past, not just in terms of personal memories, but really in every possible way. Maybe I should (have) be(en) an historian. When I read novels set in earlier eras, I tend towards wanting to live in that time and that place. It's not that I don't like the here and now, just that there are always certain qualities that I'd prefer if I somehow got to pick and choose a setting by anachronistic combination. I suppose the truth of it is probably that the portions of history we choose to record, or that which I tend to focus on, or even more so that which tends to be portrayed in fiction contain the best parts played up and the less appealing aspects generally subdued. But still, I always have the lingering suspicion that I would have been happier in a simpler time.

I realize in that last bit, I used the phrase "an historian" which, by all official sources is an "error" of syntax. I understand the rule for the use of "an" versus "a" and I choose to write "an historian" because this is intended to convey my thoughts and is thus written in my voice. And in my voice I tend to pronounce "an historian" in just the way that requires such writing (without an 'h' sound). Should I have intended the pronunciation, I suspect I would have written it the "correct" way. I bet I might do that if it were at the beginning of a sentence and I wanted to emphasize the historian as an important player in the sentence, but not if it needed no emphasis. For example, I might write: "A historian studies history, while a chronicler compiles a chronology of historical events." But, then I might also write: "An historian walked into a bar, and..."

A point to the first person to come up with a good ending to that bar joke! The internets don't seem to contain any, so yours may well be the first, and this page will probably eventually be the first hit on google for "an historian walked into a bar." (One can only hope for such things in these modern days)

Speaking of which, I wonder if google checks for phrases such as "this page will ... first hit on google ..." and scores them lower as a result. It probably should. Perhaps I'll mention that to my coworker tomorrow at his last-day-lunch, since he's leaving us for Google's doesn't-officially-exist-yet-clearly-does Cambridge lab.

Did I say I was cleaning? Well, I made some progress. Now back to my other favorite non-work and non-theatre activity, sleep!




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[info]cerylium
2006-03-10 01:33 pm UTC (link)
"An historian" is, in fact, grammatically correct. As a budding historian of science, I should know :)

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[info]thedan
2006-03-10 02:49 pm UTC (link)
I disagree, but I haven't researched it. Do you have a citation?

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A clarification...
[info]cerylium
2006-03-10 03:00 pm UTC (link)
Josh was actually exactly correct. You write how you speak. Brits tend to under-pronounce "h" so they are more likely to write "an historian". It is also more arcaic to drop the H, given josh's entry, it thus seems perfectly acceptable to go olde tyme and write "an historian", both gramatically and semantically. strangely, the tradition of dropping the "h" is also an NJ thing (note use of an, because I'm saying "an En Jay"). People who have never left the state say "uman" as opposed to "human" and other crazy things. AskOxford.com tells us this:

"The form an for the indefinite article is used before a spoken vowel sound, regardless of how the written word is spelt. If you say 'an otel' when speaking (which is now often regarded as distinctly old-fashioned), then it may be appropriate for you to write 'an hotel'; but most people say 'hotel' with a sounded 'h', and should write 'a hotel'."

So, if you say "an istorian" for for it, and write the an!

http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutgrammar/hotel

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[info]justsomesleddog
2006-03-10 04:41 pm UTC (link)
Possible punchlines (most of which are terrible):

"... and said 'Ow, that hurt.'"

"... and asks for a drink. The bartender says, 'Sorry, we haven't had a liquor license in over 200 years.'"

"... and the bartender offers him a beer. The historian looks puzzled. 'You're allowed to serve alcohol in this establishment? What about the 18th amendment?' The bartender says, 'Are you crazy? That was repealed in 1933!' 'According to some,' says the historian, 'but I don't subscribe to revisionist theories.'"

"... and the bartender asks how he can be of help. 'I'm doing research on the history of religious turmoil, and I was looking for a rabbi, a priest, and a Irishman. Someone told me I could find them in a joke similar to this one.'"

"... and the bartender says, 'Oh, great, here comes another lame joke.'"

Okay, those are terrible. Historians are inherently not funny.

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[info]thedan
2006-03-10 04:43 pm UTC (link)
I love the third one.

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We have a winner!
[info]joshulux
2006-03-10 06:24 pm UTC (link)
And the first good historian walks into a bar joke on the internet is:

"An historian walks into a bar and the bartender offers him a beer. The historian looks puzzled. 'You're allowed to serve alcohol in this establishment? What about the 18th amendment?' The bartender says, 'Are you crazy? That was repealed in 1933!' 'According to some,' says the historian, 'but I don't subscribe to revisionist theories.'"

A point for Rhode!

Although I'm not sure it wouldn't be better in past tense:
"An historian walked into a bar and the bartender offered him a beer. The historian looked puzzled. 'You're allowed to serve alcohol in this establishment? What about the 18th amendment?' The bartender said, 'Are you crazy? That was repealed in 1933!' 'According to some,' said the historian, 'but I don't subscribe to revisionist theories.'"


Actually, the second and fourth ones have potential, if they could be reframed a bit. The fourth one has a good concept, but lacks a punchline. The second one could have something to do with the fact that this particular place used to be a bar 200 years ago, but is now something else. Unfortunately we need to keep "an historian walks/walked into a bar" so this place would still have to be a "bar" -- I suppose it could be a Sushi bar or something, but that seems less funny somehow. Perhaps an Oxygen Bar, or something about the bar exam (although that's not really a place).

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Re: We have a winner!
[info]justsomesleddog
2006-03-10 06:49 pm UTC (link)
Regarding the second one... I was trying to think of who else the bartender could be to show that the place is no longer a bar, but I couldn't come up with one, so I left it as bartender. I mean, what do old bars get turned into?

"and Chuck E. Cheese said..." doesn't really work because bars don't usually get turned into children's arcades, not to mention that Chuck E. Cheese doesn't actually work there.

"and the maitre'D said..." also doesn't work because they're not really funny. Not to mention that most restaurants do have liquor licenses.

Maybe "and the barista said..." to indicate that it was taken over by Starbucks?

Writing jokes is harder than it looks. The other three are just spin-offs of "A foo walked into a bar..." jokes that I already know. (Although admittedly, the fourth one tries to relate it to the historian.) But that third one is all me... I didn't actually think it was funny while I was writing it, but now that I'm not racking my brain for historian punchlines, it is kind of funny.

And I've always told bar jokes in the present tense. I don't know why... it doesn't necessarily seem funnier to me either way.

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[info]justsomesleddog
2006-03-11 07:51 pm UTC (link)
Just FYI, this page is now the first (and only) hit for "An historian walked into a bar" on google. Victory!

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Hmmm
[info]joshulux
2006-03-11 11:57 pm UTC (link)
My google disagrees with yours, it seems.

I get nothing for that right now.

Altavista, however, has the colussus of rhode as the number one hit for same.

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Re: Hmmm
[info]joshulux
2006-03-13 04:17 pm UTC (link)
Now both this page and the colossus are showing up on google. So, historians, what do you think of our first historian walked into a bar joke?

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Re: Hmmm
[info]justsomesleddog
2006-03-13 06:40 pm UTC (link)
I searched for it in quotes... maybe that makes a difference.

And now, as you observed, both of us are there... but I'm ahead of you. :) It's Amal's fault. I get a lot of pagerank from the TTC page.

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Re: Hmmm
[info]joshulux
2006-03-13 06:47 pm UTC (link)
I also searched for it in quotes (of course). It definitely wasn't showing up for me yesterday. I wonder if google takes a while to propagate updates to all of its server farms / whether certain IP addresses are always served by the same site..?

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